I have to speak my mind on this because of the tragedy that happened each of the past few years. I'm speaking of how kids are competing and not having a coach there matside to coach them. Here we are at this discussion again. I watched Kearney in the medal rounds after Class D had wrapped up and Class A had several weight classes to go. At that point there were 4 potential mats, as there was for much of the tournament, where kids in successive weight classes could be called to. This also happened to us two years ago in the quarterfinals when Class D was done, only we had a potential 8 mats where kids could be called to. The point I'm trying to make is there is always potential when kids in successive weight classes could be up and not enough coaches are allowed on the floor. If we are all in this business for the kids then this needs to change. I have talked with Darin Boysen as well as our district representative to the NSAA. I, along with my AD, will be working on it. I hope to have the support from the smaller schools as well as it could effect you as well. Imagine your only 4 qualifiers are in successive weight classes and you only get two coaches. They all come up at the same time. Someone gets left without. It's not fair and it needs to change. Other sports are not limited when they qualify for a state event. We should not be either. If anyone has ideas of how to help solve this problem please email me at mschadwi@gips.org. I hope to help make this situation better for all of us coaches and most importantly for our kids.

While calling the medal matches with Ross and Jim I called it "petarded" and I still think it is "petarded". I snapped a picture of it and posted it on another thread and it is also below.

I aggree with you Coach that the wrestlers must have representation in the corner for each match. I did like how at least in the first two A-D sessions, they did not move any matches to other mats. But as you stated above, if you had wrestlers in four succesive weights, the possibility still existed that you could have four wrestlers going on four mats.

If I am reading your post correct there is one thing I would disagree with, "Other sports are not limited when they qualify for a state event, We should not be either." If you are trying to say that each school should not be limited to the number of coaches they are allowed to have on the floor, I can't go along with that. While I know many schools have upwards of 5, 6 or more "assistant" coaches, the space available on the floor in any arena dictates that the number of coaches has to be limited. I would suggest that 4 be the maximum number of coaches allowed with the stipulation that those in charge at the NSAA would not open more than 4 mats to one class at any time. That way at least 4 kids could each have a coach.


Here's the picture I snapped.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Red Rocker,

You've got my support, I've said it's not right for years. You have guys that put in time with the program and work with these kids all year and when it comes to the biggest tourney, they can't coach. I'm telling you something, I for one am getting tired of watching our sport get hamstringed so much more than any other sport. Skin for example, yes I know there are things that are dangerous, but honestly, if you clear the first day, what in the he!! can you get in the next two that is life threatening. I have seen more basketball players with shingles, ringworm, impetigo, etc. that any of our wrestlers have ever had, but yet they don't miss a day of practice, let alone a game. Sorry to hi jack coach just got me on a rant, but the number of coaches and skin are just two of the things wrestling gets hit the hardest with, there are a couple more that are also unequal too but I've already ruined your thread

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Eagle1,

OK I agree that maybe I sounded as if an unlimited amount would be alright, that's not feasible in this or probably most arenas, but at least as many coaches as there are potential mats available would be better to cover our kids. At the very least, the NSAA should write a policy for the state event that states: any kid without a coach matside may wait until a coach becomes avaiable, even if there is a basketball game that night...

Maybe the rule could read as such:
1 qualifier = 1 coach
2-4 qualifiers = 2 coaches
6-9 qualifiers = 3 coaches
10-14 qualifiers = 4 coaches

I agree that the NSAA made a good decision to leave the D mats closed to A wrestlers during the quarterfinals because we would have had 119-285 going in that round and could very likely had 4 or even 5 guys up at one time with 8 mats going, but what happened to Kearney is just flat not right for kids!

I didn't really think you meant "unlimited" but had to make sure!

I believe it was at the 2008 tournament, Millard South and Kearney had 4 mats going at the same time at the end of the quarterfinal round. Here we have kids trying to get in for a medal and one or more not able to have a coach. With the increased amount of floor space over what was available at Devaney, there is no reason any team with 4 or more qualifiers shouldn't be able to have 4 coaches on the floor.

I think this would be a very good issue for the NSWCA to take up. I know that Norm Manstedt is the President this year and he would be the one to contact to get things started. The coaches will have to get their AD's behind this also because they will have more pull with the Board representatives than the rest of us.

And Eagle1 I agree, the skin thing is just as "petarded".

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Red Rocker,

I like the "up to 4 coaches passes" idea too. But would also add the "wait for the coach if the wrestler still doesn't have one." For the amount of times this would actually happen and then to account for the amount of time extra it would take extending the tournament round...is minimal. Do it for the kids...it should always be about betterment for the kids when policy is made....not money....end of story.

kearney had 5 different coaches on the floor macann 2 millers doberstien and von. doesnt each school get 3 passes maximun.

quote:

Originally posted by Dad:
kearney had 5 different coaches on the floor macann 2 millers doberstien and von. doesnt each school get 3 passes maximun.

This is part of the problem. Not saying that it is only Kearney that does this. While I agree SchadGI that more coaches should be allowed on the floor. This is my proposal.
1-3 2 coaches
3-6 3 coaches
6-14 4 coaches
Most schools have at least 2 coaches and they should be allowed to coach even with only one kid. Maybe they could make it so the bracelets could come off and be passed between coaches. This would work a lot better if coaches policed their own teams. I saw several wrestlers from previous years with brothers wrestling down on the floor with no coaches bracelet. It would be insane to ask the NSAA or the Qwest staff to try and catch everyone like that. Schad correct me if I'm wrong but I heard last year that GI let the dads that helped with Team GI or the middle school come down and coach their kids in the finals. Very cool idea! Even better if they didn't have to sneak around to get down their. Having passable bracelets or passes to get down on the floor and coaches policing their own teams better would make this a situation a lot better.

You know Red Rocker and Eagle 1, it is ok to have all of these thoughts and opinions, but if you could please focus on the words chosen to speak them, it would be greatly appreciated. Those of us that have children that are mental handicapped, we would like to see the "r-word" disappear. If those post could be edited, to use different, more appropriate terminology, I for one would appreciate it. Thank you.

Me too!

Sodbuster and ref, I agree, sometimes we don't even think about the actual meaning. I use it meaning I think something is stupid or not right and I apologize. No offense intended and as someone who has worked with mentally handicapped before, I should know better. Editing right now.

I appreciate it. Thank you.

quote:

Originally posted by Dad:
kearney had 5 different coaches on the floor macann 2 millers doberstien and von. doesnt each school get 3 passes maximun.

Yes you are correct, that is an issue also that some teams are favored or are able to obtain bands while others aren't. I agree with the initial thread post but it can't be done with favoritism either because I know that a few of them teams in class A besides Kearney had more than 3 on the mats last year also. Interesting how those can be obtained when each coach has to check in at the table and have them put on. I was told that some of the NSAA higher ups were giving out bracelets to other people, much like a good old boy network....sorry but that is even more wrong, the standard needs to be the same and yes there needs to be at least 4 if you have more than 8 wrestlers qualify!

I was wondering Thursday why they weren't making use of all the mats for A after D got done so early, and hadn't given this any thought until then. I think it would make complete sense to give those who have more than 9-10 qualifiers the option of having four coaches on the floor at the same time.

What I don't like, though, is "coaches" trying to wiggle their way on to the floor through the use of media credentials. I know one editor friend of mine was asked by a coach if he could finagle a press pass for him, and it's obvious it wasn't so he could take pictures.

There are ways of helping our wrestlers get the best coaching situations available, and I hope the NSAA Board of Control, in its infinite wisdom, sees the intelligence of your proposal, coach.

This will be my rant on here concerning the state tournament and the operation of it. I do agree with the band situation, as far as the amount of bands given out, even with 4, 5, or 6 kids, 2 bands per squad is simply not enough. Onto my next vent, I feel the coaches are almost treated like second class citizens when we walk into the Qwest Center. You have a bunch of rent a cops that have checked out a Qwest Grey Jacket and now want to try to throw their weight around. One example, in Class D we had to enter the coaches "runway" through mat 5 and then exit by mat 8. I have a kid on Mat 8 and had came in by mat 8 and was not allowed to enter the mat until I literally jumped the corral, what the hell would it of hurt for me to simply walk to Mat 8. On the two side mats, namely mat 5 and mat 8 (once again I was class D), the media is allowed to walk to their table on the sides of those mats, which happens to be right next to the two chairs in the corner. We have a kid on deck on that mat, and we have to walk to the gate opening in 7-8 or 5-6 and walk in front of the score keepers during a time when the clock is not moving to get to that corner. Where is common sense, seriously! My last vent for now would be you have multiple media personnel in the Qwest center, and I know there are those that are not "true" media, but any media would be appreciated and I don't think anybody can argue with that. But the media has a somewhat secure room, tables, internet connections, etc. where they are given updated brackets, drinks, I heard (once again, heresay) snacks within a short distance of the competition area,and the NSAA personnel, the directors, etc., (not the volunteer workers as they definetely deserve it_ is catered to with water, pop, etc. and have a "hospitality room" to go to on the competition level. and then us coaches receive a partition in the upper area with donuts and coffee and donuts that are provided by the Coaches Association (which is appreciated, do not get me wrong) on the upper concourse a good distance fromt he competition area. Where does the NSAA get off by treating themselves and the media members to all of these perks or plusses, and then has the people (namely coaches) who put in all the work during the season, not just a long weekend, see nothing from the group that is making a fortune off of our hard work and dedication. There is my vent for now...

Mikey, I would say the media passes are abused by way more parents than coaches. I'd much rather see a coach get a media pass so he can get on the floor and coach the kids he's coached all year than mom or dad that's only taking pictures of their boy. While we're on the subject, I love all the media coverage, but some of them better start to realize that while they're there, we coaches have a job to do and so do the wrestlers. I've had photographers basically push their way in front of me or my wrestlers when we're trying to get to the mat. I've actually give them a few words for it too. The other thing that really bugs me is the small town media. They have someone covering their team but during the match, guess which corner they're crowding and getting in the way in? Not their towns, but the opponents. I'm not gonna be too nice about that anymore either.

I have no experience on the high school level, but from coaching a few times at the Tulsa Nationals at the youth level, a venue somewhat similar to the big stakes of the state high school tournament, I believe the kid wrestling at districts or state (or in these big youth tournaments) should have the right to point out to the referee that he does not have a coach, and have a pre-determined amount of time to get a coach to the mat. The vast majority of the time, the kid wrestling knows exactly where his coach is, and knows he will be at matside as soon as the other match is done.

What amount of time? Say five to seven minutes as an appoximate max.

There are simply too many variables such as other overtime matches, blood time, injuries, etc. to assume all coaches can make it to matside immediately.

The particular circumstance that comes to mind for the Tulsa Nationals youth tournament is where I had responsibility for two wrestlers: Andy Pokorny and Derek Vogel. Although they were in different age groups and weight classes, they came up at the same time. I did a poor job of covering both mats and they both lost one point decisions that I believe they both should have won with a concentrated coach.

Kids work all year for their chance to advance at the district and state tournaments. Shouldn't they have a right to a coach in their corner?

I agree with the original poster, and most others on this thread, that no kid should have to wrestle unless their coach is there, and that with the way it has been run, with changing mats, that this may not be possible.What gets me fired up a bit though as well, is that that is true for all teams, but a few find it ok to shirk the rules, and get other credentials, or passes when other teams who also need more coaches are denied that advantage. Mike, you guys had five wrist bands, and I know they didn't just hand them to you, so how did you get them. To me, that also seems an unfair advantage to the rest of us.Let's work together to change the rule, but go by the rule until then.

Something I also dont understand is, if enough room for other coaches is the issue, then why on the entire length of the floor on the north side of the mats, do they have those 6 or 8 rows of covered seats.That is a lot of room that could be utilized to make it less congested. Can those seats be moved out, allowing more than just 3 feet behind the railing on the floor?

I agree with Schadwinkle on this topic with coaches. I couldn't believe they called 4 matches on Kearney in a huge round for a medals. Why not allow 5 coaches passes, because most teams have a head coach, 1st assistant, 2nd assistant and usually at least 2 more coaches. This would help especially when you have 3-4 wrestlers wrestling at the same time and this also allows the coaches to keep score for themselves. I know in basketball they get to have all their coaches on the floor. This was a bad disadvantage for Kearney with 4 mats going, David Miller coachin 3 mats in the middle and its hard to get a good coached match especially in the medal rounds and when your team is in a team race for second place. Hopefully this can be changed, so this situation doesn't happen again.

Marcus Hellwege

I'd like to comment on on the recent posts of SchadGI. It is pretty easy for me to see why you have a successful program. You are very knowledgeable and forward thinking - stuff thats contagious with others.

That said, you are spot on in not only this post but in the "Lincoln needs to build it" post.

I head coached at AL in Council Bluffs in 2008, the team qualified 4 guys, all four coaches got coaches passes. I remember thinking many times that year how things ran much better and made more sense. All coaches are rewarded and able to coach on the floor. In Nebraska, it creates tension among coaches and creates the nightmare scenario of not having a coach in the corner. I am glad you have contacted Boysen because this should change immediately.

In terms of the Lincoln post. Again, you are on the mark. NSAA tries to push these rounds by as quickly as possible. No time for wrestlers to recover, not very fan friendly. Iowa's tournament has three classes, yet they start at 1pm on Wednesday and end 10pm Saturday night with an all class final.

I hope everyone realizes your words are only trying to create a win-win for the Sport, the wrestlers, the Parents/fans, even the NSAA.