Here's a good one. I just got back from a C District meeting (possibly longest ever) but grew up in Class B school. Why does class A only have 8 schools, class B 12 (I think) and class C 16. We did not have one bracket with less then 8 wrestlers. Is class A easier to qualify then the rest? Is this fair? Let the debate begin

Without a doubt it is easier to qualify in Class A than it is in the other classes. Class A traditionally has a greater number of wrestlers with sub-.500 records who, quite honestly, would probably not qualify in any other class.

And before the Class A folks start getting all fired up, remember back to the year the NSAA tried the one-size-fits-all 24-school classification setup. A number of wrestlers in Class A qualified with ZERO wins, and one weight class actually had a first-round bye because one district had just three wrestlers.

Now having said that, some of the brackets in C and D are not as tough to get through as one might think with 16 or 17 teams in the district, for the simple fact that a number of schools in those classes do not field a full 14-man team, so it is possible a wrestler in that class may wrestle as many, or even fewer, matches than a Class A wrestler will have to go through at districts.

Also, consider that B, C and D operate out of 16-man brackets, which potentially leaves two extra rounds of wrestling. A wrestler in B, C or D who loses in the first round would wrestle six total matches to qualify for state, while a wrestler in Class A needs only four matches, assuming a first-round loss, to qualify.

So why the differnece?
I was always told that class A has bigger populations therefore are more likely to fill out brackets. But having 8 wrestlers compared to 14 doesn't make sense.

This also hurts next year for seeding. A class A kid could be 1-25 but made it to state and a class B/C/D kid didn't. The seed would go to the class A kid

What's hard is being in the B-2 district and having my son just barely missing qualifying last year. And then look at the Class A qualifiers to see some of them that my son soundly beat or pinned through out the year making it to state. Very frustrating for him. And me! Because I know how hard he has worked to have a successful record. Hopefully he qualifies this year...

Bagooba,
Couldn't agree more and good luck to your kid this year.
Some coaches outside the states have said we should go to a three class system. The guys from Iowa think that's best. Only problem I see that the NSAA would say is that it makes less kids participate at state. Is that a good thing or bad?

The problem becomes where to draw the line. And right or wrong one of the big arguments will be (and was if you remember a few years ago when the proposal was put forward to expand Class A to 40 teams in wrestling) that you have the largest class school, Omaha Central with 2103 kids competing against Grand Island Northwest with 528 when you go to 40 in Class A. The next 48 would be Omaha Skutt with 525 to Southern with 165.

Splitting it into 3 classes all being equal in number of teams would give you 72 teams in Class A which would be Omaha Central with 2103 kids in the same class with Wayne at 208, the next 71 would be Ashland-Greenwood with 206 to Chase County with 106 and the last 71 being Newman Grove/Lindsay Holy Family with 104 to McPherson County with 19.



My opinion, make class A 3 qualifiers per district with the District champs getting a bye in the first round of the State Tournament.

Other than that, make it like California and make it all one class with districts and regionals prior to the state tournament.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Red Rocker:
The problem becomes where to draw the line. And right or wrong one of the big arguments will be (and was if you remember a few years ago when the proposal was put forward to expand Class A to 40 teams in wrestling) that you have the largest class school, Omaha Central with 2103 kids competing against Grand Island Northwest with 528 when you go to 40 in Class A.

Red Rocker:
Do you know why the proposal feel through back then?

quote:

Originally posted by Newman:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Red Rocker:
The problem becomes where to draw the line. And right or wrong one of the big arguments will be (and was if you remember a few years ago when the proposal was put forward to expand Class A to 40 teams in wrestling) that you have the largest class school, Omaha Central with 2103 kids competing against Grand Island Northwest with 528 when you go to 40 in Class A.

Red Rocker:
Do you know why the proposal feel through back then?

Seems like the Board of Control tabled it to study it and nothing has been heard of it since. That was in 2006 by the way.

As a fan I would enjoy watching one class to see some great match ups but understand that the tradition of a multi class is not goin to allow that to happen.

The one argument I'd have, RR, is that enrollment numbers are somewhat overstated in their importance.

For example, if Omaha Skutt were in Class A, they would be the smallest school in the class. But you and I both know that when state tournament rolls around, the smallest school will be beating the bigger-enrollment schools from here to eternity. Omaha Central may be the biggest school in the state, but with all due respect, nobody's shaking in their boots about having to beat them to win a state title because of their massive number of students.

As for reducing it to three classes, don't bet on that happening anytime soon, because the NSAA is all about making money and they won't be able to do that if they have only three classes vs. four. More classes means more wrestlers, which means more families attending, which means more medals and keeping that come-on-get-happy feeling that comes from having more champions, which means more bank for the NSAA.

Mikey,

I thought you had a paper to lay out or something...

Besides, I think GI might have a problem with one of your comments. LOL

quote:

Originally posted by wrestler:
Bagooba,
Couldn't agree more and good luck to your kid this year.
Some coaches outside the states have said we should go to a three class system. The guys from Iowa think that's best. Only problem I see that the NSAA would say is that it makes less kids participate at state. Is that a good thing or bad?

The Iowa system works great for Iowa. I think their state sees participation not just through a "state tourney" lens, but districts and sectionals in 1A & 2A. They also have a state dual meet. I am not sure they view it as a participation concern at all.

Some of the discussions from 2006 regarding 40 teams in Class A.

"Class A 40 Teams"

"What you can do to make 40 teams happen"

"More Competitive Versus Greater Participation"

Lets say "if" Skutt was in class A, do you think that they would have won the same amount of team titles as they have going now? I think they would have won some but not the streak they have now. I agree class A should have more teams and there are some very average kids making it to the state tourney, but there are also average kids making it in other classes as well. I read about Class A jv kids placing if not winning some class C and D tourneys, sure maybe not the "stud" tourneys but still kids in those tourneys that will make it to state and the JV kid can't get on the mat for Class A. There is a kid at Bell East who can't crack the line up but was a qualifier last year in class B for Blair and missed placing by one match. If you want an easy way for your son to make it to the state tourney then move to a Class A school, I'm sure it will be a ton easier to make the state tourney then.

RR, this link talks about class system a bit too...

H/S Coaches I need input and ideas.

If you move Skutt to class A You'd be Pulling the enrollment cap off...I don't believe that would be a good decision....

I didn't really read the entire thread, but in my opinion, I think its good the way it is.

I don't wanna see less teams in the other classes (B, C, D)

Now i agree that its waaaaaay to easy to qualify in class A, but it is how it is. Do I think Class A has the best competition? No, but they produce alot of the "3 and 4 time state champions" moreso than the other class...or so it seems (didn't look it up). So depth wise Class A probably isn't very strong. I think Class B and C probably take the cake there.

But maybe i'm bias coming from a school like Ord.

Everyones opinion is different, but is definitely a good topic to discuss.

quote:

Originally posted by Vader:
RR, this link talks about class system a bit too...

H/S Coaches I need input and ideas.

Skutt has had several kids go to state and not wrestle varsity the next year.

Seems to me, you take the top 6 district finishers to state. Medal the top 8 at state and that will give you parity. This will give NSAA more money and all the right kids will make it to state.

I am just a rookie here but it seems to me that the A districts are 8 man brackets because there are only 32 A teams in the state. If there were only 2 - 16 team districts then that means the state tourney would be 8 man. I realize there are some schools who are D in wrestling but C1 or c2 in football but I think the NSAA is not overly concerned with the quality of competition and doesn't want to deal with the complexities of a lot of schools being in different classes for different sports. I felt bad for my kid knowing that kids he beat made it to state just because they were in a weaker district but such is life. I also feel bad when a quality kid doesn't make it because he had an off day. But I wouldn't suggest a "wildcard" system for those kids. I think no matter how you slice it, some kids that should be there, won't and vice versa. It's just fine the way it is.

I actually would be in favor of a wild card system similar to college, but then I'd also be in favor or bringing back riding time so maybe I'm old fashioned.