| Rookie Location: Columbus Registered: December 03, 2007 Posts: 21 |  posted I think I am starting to understand. World class facility well run tournement and no one comes to watch. It's not just one thing but the package dosn't work for everyone. If you live in Omaha and can stay at home how could you have a better tournement. If you live out state and have to deal with the motels and driving in the big city you are frustrated. Lets not hide our heads in the sand and say there is not a problem. Some of the solutions I find insulting. Do a better job of smulging in water and snacks. Or move down into sone one elses assinged seats. To me you are saying your just not good at stealing and cheating. I was taught to steal and cheat is wrong I won't go there. If the ticket draw if stacked and I don't have the same chance at the seats as Millard South and Skutt have I want to know and I will not return. It is intimidating for out state Nebraskan to drive in Omaha. To go see world class entertainment people will fight the crowd. This is the state wrestling championship. Not world class entertainment. This crowd needs to be coddled or they may not come back. I am worried we have all ready run off many it will be hard to get them back. Nebraska only has 1,500,000 people most are not wrestling fans. In this case a sucker is not born every day. Lets work together to make this the best championship possible. |
| Rookie Registered: December 30, 2004 Posts: 79 | posted Attendance is the main topic of this thread. Many have expressed their thoughts, expertise, & feelings. All have legitimate points, at least from their point of view. I am only offering a possible factor in the demise in attendance. During the state tournament I had a conversation about this very topic with one of my former wrestlers who is now a senior at UNL. He remarked that he was the only one from his graduating class or any class close to his that was at the tournament. He also stated that “back in his day” there would be at least 30 fans from our town that were in that age group. (I later saw one other wrestling alumni from his class.) Part of the lack of that demographic attending from our school could be attributed to our team not being as competitive as we were. I believe that the main factor is convenience. Most schools have many alumni attending UNL. A substantial number of them would go to Devaney because it was convenient and it was “the thing to do”. They did not have to get motel rooms or make any special accommodations to their daily routines. In addition many high school kids would go to Lincoln and stay with their friends that were UNL students for free. Again, no motel room necessary, less $$ out of pocket. For attendance from our school I would say that this effects in somewhere in the range of 30-50 people not attending since it has moved to the Qwest. Repeat this scenario to some degree for all the schools at the State Wrestling Tournament and that is quite a chunk of people. Is the Qwest a better facility than the “Bob”? Hands down yes. Ticket sales are down around 30% from when the tournament was in Lincoln. Will “money talk” and the NSAA move it back to Lincoln? That remains to be seen. Is it better to have to turn away 1000 or so fans in a 14,500 seat arena or to have empty seats and around 4000 fewer fans in a larger, better facility? Depends on your point of view.This message has been edited. Last edited by: dbonge, |
| State Qualifier Registered: March 21, 2005 Posts: 1035 | posted
I would like to address 3 of your points, but first want to congratulate you on a great closing sentence in your post. "Let's work together to make this the best championship possible". That should be the goal for all of us. My concern is the large number of Qwest haters that insist on picking at every little thing that may have gone wrong. If they continue to spread the word that the Qwest Center is a terrible place to hold the state tournament they can influence some people to stay away. Now let's address your other points. You said it was wrong to steal and cheat, which is what you would be doing if you moved into someone else's assigned seat. If the person who bought the ticket didn't come to the tournament I can't see that you are cheating anyone. I live in Omaha but root for Gretna. So I asked Joe, the head ticket buyer at Gretna to order tickets for me because I like to sit with the green people. On Thursday and Friday morning our tickets were just above Mat 8. On several occasions we had a wrestler on Mat 4, diagonally across the arena from where we were sitting. It was difficult to see the clock and scoreboard so several of us ran around to the seats on the end of the arena above Mat 4. There were several open seats scattered around among some Bennington Badgers fans. Those fine blue people moved over and even moved back a few rows so the green fans coud get down to matside. When the match was over we went back to our seats. We did the same thing several times. If the blue people felt cheated or stolen from they didn't show any sign of it. You made the comment that outstate people are intimidated by Omaha traffic. It can be intimidating but we have to realize that any city large enough to build an arena that can host the tournament is going to have a lot of traffic. I think that if you pick a concentrated area, such as a city block, there won't be any more cars in that block at a specific time than there would be in a city block in Lincoln. The difference is that Omaha has more people and spreads out farther than Lincoln. Does it really matter if you drive in heavy traffic for 5 miles in Lincoln or 7 miles in Omaha? You have what may be a legitimate concern about seating. I seriously doubt that anyone at Qwest, NSAA, CIA, or any other organization conspired to reserve choice blocks of seats for Skutt and Millard South fans. I think those fans were probably first in line on opening day of ticket sales so they could select their blocks of seats. But this is the kind of thing that I addressed in my long post a few notches up this thread. I would like to see the coaches organize and meet with NSAA and the Board of Control to discuss issues like this. Perhaps NSAA has never looked into different ways of allocating tickets because it never occurred to them that it was a problem. Until we solve all of these problems let's focus on your closing sentence, "Let's work together to make this the best championship possible." |
| Rookie Location: Omaha, NE Registered: January 17, 2008 Posts: 32 | posted I don't know how you think Skutt's seats were great? They were up in the "nosebleeds". The seats that some people sat in right in front of the Class B are not for sale. If you remember last year there were tarps over them. |
Rookie Registered: September 27, 2005 Posts: 155 | posted I like to follow some of the kids we wrestle from KS. Their State Tourney has 4 classes & compete at different locations: 6A-Wichita, 5A-Hutchinson, 4A-Salina & 321A-Hays. Frank, Coach Bonge might have a point about the costs associated with staying in Lincoln but what about the Omaha area folks? Are they coming out or are they staying home? With the population base you would think that they would fill the place up. Saturday Grampa & Grandma came down to watch the Finals. Got there 2.5 hrs before they started & had to park several blocks away. They are elderly folks with health problems & even though they have a handicap license, there was no where to park close. There were dozens of open stalls in the garage but they were "reserved". A lot of the fans that come to watch are immediate family, alot of grammas & grampas & the move from Devaney was supposed to make it easier & more convienient not less so. Frank, in that vein maybe the idea of a Board of Control meeting with the Coaches Association & Qwest would help. Many of Bulldog's comments hit home with those of us with elderly fans. They come to watch their Grand kids not to get a "stingin" as I've heard it put. |
| Rookie Registered: November 10, 2007 Posts: 4 | posted I had a great motel to stay for state wrestling close to qwest. No frills just clean and I felt safe. I came down to state by myself. I didn't feel like I could chaperone my elderly parents and navigate Omaha all at once. I think the biggest hangup is the traffic. And I didn't have any problems. I left early and only had a mile of traffic. Qwest personel was nice. I didn't buy any concessions they were too high. I would love to see state wrestling at Kearney.... I can't exactly say what is wrong, but there is something......Maybe next year will be better. |
| Junior Varsity Location: pierce, ne Registered: February 11, 2004 Posts: 736 | posted I am not interested in arguing about Omaha, the qwest center or anything else to do with the State Wrestling Tournament. I stated earlier that we recieved some fairly bad service at more that one restaurant we went too. After sitting down and thinking about it and discussing it with others, I just feel that the restaurants we chose were not prepared for big crowds of people and that is the reason they may have been short with us. I dont mind the tourney being in omaha. traffic was not a problem for us, and we only had one small issue with our hotel. That issue was loud music, but we didnt complain about it and i havent "whined" about it. It was a little expected because there is a bar/nightclub attached to the hotel. Other than that, our hotel was fine. The reason we stay there is because it is fairly cheap and within reasonable distance to the qwest. It also has a pool,hottubs, workout room,etc. I said before and i will say it again, I understand that the tourney will probably stay in Omaha for a long period of time. I just wish the city would open its arms and welcome the fans like Lincoln did.I know some of you will tell us to go somewhere else if we dont like the service, but that is not the point. Omaha and Lincoln have different "feels" to them and I understand that. I am not scared of Omaha, I actually have spent alot of time there over the years, I just think the city could do more. Im not going to boycott omaha or the tourney and never have said I would, I am a "permanent" fan and I always will be!!! As far as the attendance issue goes, I have no explanation other than what has already been shared on here. I do agree that the UNL students and high school students that stayed with friends in Lincoln are a big missing part. I have no complaints about seating, because I am lucky enough to have a pass that allows me to sit down low when needed and I didnt have to go through checks so I have nothing to say about that either. I hope noone takes what I have said as an insult to Omaha, it is not meant to be!! I just truly hope that people can come to a mid point and start talking about reasonable solutions to the true issue and that is attendance!! Guaranteed LOUDEST guy in the gym!!!! |
Junior Varsity Location: Imperial, NE Registered: October 28, 2002 Posts: 792 | posted OK, enough on the seating. The tickets are assigned by lottery. When a school buys a block of seats, I would imagine they are going to get placed according to where they can all be together. I ordered tickets for our school, a whopping 24 tickets packages. Our seats were spread over three rows. I wish more schools would have the following of Skutt and Kearney. It looks cool to look in the stands and see them together in their matching shirts. I can't even get parents to order tickets unless they are "sure" their wrestler has a shot of making it to state let alone convince them we should dress alike for 3 days. |
| Junior High Registered: April 26, 2005 Posts: 503 | posted Why don't we complete what has already begun: Split the tournament. Class A in Omaha, Classes B,C, and D in Kearney: Urban in urban and rural in rural. If attendance by the rural community is truly driven by location and culture, Kearney will provide an apprpriate forum and B,C,D attendance will increase. Omaha metro. attendance will remain consistent. And don't tell me about how divisive that would be. Judging by content of this thread, the division is complete. |
Varsity Letterman Registered: October 19, 2002 Posts: 856 | posted
I have driven grain trucks back on the farm so driving a school bus is easy. Plus they pay me extra to drive the bus, and I never have to worry about the driver being late. |
| Varsity Letterman Registered: October 19, 2002 Posts: 856 | posted
The Blue people were more than happy to accommodate you. |
| Varsity Letterman Registered: October 19, 2002 Posts: 856 | posted Just for you Shannon. I would say declining attendance is the result of the following (in order): 1. Lack of interesting team races. The exception is class C. The class C crowd seemed to be very good. Fort Calhoun always has great support; David City, Madison, and Sargent/Burwell all seemed to have good crowds. Our crowd was the best ever and four times what we had several years ago. The past four years we have brought home three trophies and one third place finish. Exciting team races bring in better crowds. 2. Economy - $3.00 plus gas prices, possible recession, etc. 3. Prices – lamest excuse in my opinion. Plenty examples of reasonable hotel costs on this site, free parking if you are willing to walk a couple of blocks (I walk further for free at Husker football games), proper planning on meals you can get away with not eating at the Qwest. If you are cheap like me you can get away with paying very little at the Qwest. 4. Not familiar/fear of Omaha. Too many people come to the state tournament with a negative image of Omaha and sometimes that is a self fulfilling prophecy. If you come into it with a negative attitude the bad things will shine over all the good things. How often do you hear bad things from people going to the state track meet? Track people are familiar with the area because they have been coming to Omaha for years and their attitude is that they are happy to be there. 5. Media and internet coverage has exploded. You can now sit at home or work, get almost immediate results, and listen live. In the past you had to wait until the next day to get the newspaper for results. Just one man's opinion, don't get upset or take any offense to what I said. |
Junior Varsity Location: O'Neill, NE Registered: November 18, 2005 Posts: 613 | posted Badger....all 5 reasons are certainly viable...I especially agree with #5 as I brought that subject up in an earlier post...I'm just wondering if it may be higher on the list, especially since you can tie that in with the other 4...The reason I say that is by taking the increased media coverage into consideration, one could avoid all the other "problems" by staying home and not missing any work...it's the financial no-brainer, but it's sad because you would like the biggest turnout for the kid's sake and the sport's sake. Perhaps all of us(including myself...heck, I've been personally crusading for this the past 25 years) bucking for the increased state media coverage has created a monster? |
   Moderator Location: Good Ole USA Registered: October 24, 2002 Posts: 6303 | posted
Post of the year. -----------------  "A PEOPLE THAT VALUES ITS PRIVILEGES OVER ITS PRINCIPLES, SOON LOSES BOTH" EISENHOWER |
| Rookie Location: Nebraska Registered: April 24, 2005 Posts: 121 | posted One thing I kind of enjoyed while it was down in Lincoln was the ability to watch a Husker dual between Saturday sessions. Don't think that this has anything to do with attendance. But is something that Qwest doesn't have. Anyway we could get UNK/UNO dual during the state weekend? Or at least a UNO dual, UNL Iowa State? On another note, I agree with RR on Franks post. Frank you always do a good job of articulating your points and trying to keep things to facts, instead of merely "fluff". If you don't invest very much, then defeat doesn't hurt you very much and winning is not very excitingy-dick vermell |
| State Qualifier Location: Norfolk,Ne Registered: October 22, 2002 Posts: 1042 | posted Why should Class A have to be the class that ends up in Omaha if it gets split? I say rotate it so all teams suffer equally. |
| Junior High Registered: March 29, 2005 Posts: 488 | posted Badger, I agree completely. All of the price things don't really add up to me either. People love to spend money. Just look at the all the money spent tailgaiting in Lincoln at FB games. I think reason #1 is very big. The others just kind of add up. I also think that Dale Bonge has a point. The crowd demographic has changed. The college and high school kids who used to fill the place are not there. Interesting. |
| Rookie Registered: January 29, 2008 Posts: 38 | posted Took me 4ever 2 read the thread so after all that time here is my 2 cents worth. I agree with several people on why attendance was down but most of all I'd have to agree with Badger and Bonge. It seems when our school is doing good and expected to do good things at state, I see ppl at the state tourney that I've never seen at any other tourney and when were not doing as well we only have our true followers and parents. As for team races, C obviously was the most exciting. Therefore, I believe (my opinion) ppl that knew the schools well or were associated w/them stayed to watch. Other classes were well wrapped up so some ppl went home 2 the big screen 2 watch the final outcome. I know of several ppl (even when it was in Linc.) as soon as every1 was done wrestling if no 1 was n the finals they went home to watch. On this I'm not knocking Skutt or M.S. or any other school that has several kids in the finals(bcuz it is a great accomplishment) but when ur filling 7-8 weight classes out of 14 in the finals with one school when it use 2 b more spread out who was in the finals that takes away from the attendance as well. As 4 all the other complaints lets get the thread out from years ago about all the complaints being in Lincoln. Not everyone is happy no matter where it is at. What WE make of the state tourney is what it will become. I don't c many kids on her complaining and that is what the state tourney is about the KIDS. I guess I'm a parent NO MATTER HOW MUCH IT WOULD COST I will b there and it doesn't matter what I would have 2 go through 2 get there! I'm 1 of those bleacher butt fans who wouldn't miss state 4 anything!!! I guess if funds were low (this not applying 2 all, maybe cut back on those cigarettes or just buy 2 beers at the bar instead of 5,or eat at home instead of going through the drive thru) My son won't even b able 2 have a chance @ state for 4 more years!! Its not a surprise on how much things are going 2 cost anymore so plan ahead. I think the atmosphere is different bcuz it is bigger and were not as closed in and bcuz of it being bigger and yes I know attendance is down but when you look across there are alot of empty seats but there are more seats to fill. N the 1st year they complained about taking all the beach balls etc. this year I didn't see them taking any and I think they have come 2 realize it will stop as soon as wrestling starts.(By the way, whoever was throwing the frisbees was PURE STUPIDITY someone could of got seriously hurt) As for food, my kids knew not to beg the whole time we were there. Yes they had their dippin dots and pretzels and they got 1 treat per session and sometimes they didn't even ask and if you go to the one concession stand they had chicken fingers and fries for $6.50 n that is not much different than going 2 BK but u don't get a pop. I know I spent alot more at Bob's bcuz it was cheaper so I forked it out alot more but times have changed. As for food afterwards, do what we do after the late session and go back 2 ur room and order a pizza! On the travel, never in the 3 years have I had trouble getting 2 the quest or having 2 wait n long traffic lines. I rem. years at Devaney taking 45 min to get down Holdridge then having 2 wait 4 a train going 5mph. Hotels, unfortunately we can't do much about it. Rudeness, that happens everywhere but I can guarantee there are more polite ppl than rude. This is no excuse to the rude ones either but just think of how many times they are getting crabbed at 4 hotel price etc. that they have no control over. After hearing about it time after time trying 2 explain things which they have no control over I think would put us all on edge after a 8 hour day(that was an i.e.)As for complaining about seating, well I can agree somewhat. We hav never had seats in the lower bowl at Quest 4 semi's and finals where at Bob's we always had a few 4 the seniors parents 2 go sit, however its not as all bad as what some make it sound but of course its not my kid down there wrestling that I'm tryin 2 watch either I'm sure if it was I'd b doin more complainin on how the seats are handed out. However, how many of u rem. gettin out 1 session and standin n lines for 4 1/2 hours b4 the next session starts 2 get a good seat? Or being 1 of the first ones in line and by the time u RUN to where u want to sit ppl have coats and blankets spread all across the seats "saving" them 4 ppl who weren't there? How bout the last year at Bob's when a mom had posted her son made it 2 state but wasn't able 2 get any tickets? We don't see the problems here. How bout a kid goin 2 get a takedown but had 2 b stopped bcuz the mats were so close the other 2 wrestlers on the other mat interfered when they went out of bounds?(now I knw that still happens) How bout the stompin threw the mud to get to Bob's?(However I never did bcuz I paid to park on the cement) and this is all cement. (Common complaint in the last years) What we make of the Quest is what state will again become. Did any1 try to start the wave this year??? Did the girls on the floor try 2 get anything goin? (Maybe they couldn't?) Until we take the positives, and take the negatives and make them into positives state will be what it will be. Whether Linc. builds a new place and state moves there we will hav the same price issues. I personally don't care where it is as long as I am there!!! I'm there to watch a great sport n I guess I'm one of those planners who knows what is going to cost me and plan for it. I'm there for the kids and hope there comfortable therefore they are the ones wrestling not me!! |
| Rookie Registered: December 13, 2007 Posts: 17 | posted
Nice Very nice but lets get to the point. poeple dont want if for there own selfish reasons and there wrong. It shold be for the kids and the safty of the kids and not all this other bs. The Quest is safer for the kids and thats [pretty much the onloy point so get over all the other stuff and remember why we are here. |
| Rookie Location: Colorado Springs, CO Registered: January 05, 2004 Posts: 160 | posted Just to give you guys an idea of how things work elsewhere, we just finished our state meet here in Colorado. We also set an attendance record for the umpteentht year in a row. To compare your plight to ours, you have Qwest Center, we have Pepsi Center. Our tickets per session were $15. Our parking within walking distance was $10, $20 close to the door. Hamburger $6.50, drink (soda, water, etc.) $4.00, Pretzel w/cheese $6.50. Seems to be close to what you are paying in a similar sized arena. And yes, we had the bag searches for illegal water bottles and the like. You think Omaha traffic is bad, try Denver in rush hour trying to make an 8am weigh in downtown. That takes some creative driving skills to say the least. Our hotel was $120 a night including a nice buffet breakfast, about 10 min from the arena. So I don't think price is the issue. Non interesting team races, maybe, but here Ponderosa has won the past 6 titles in 5A going away and it doesn't seem to be changing in the near future. Alamosa has won 4A more times than I can count and would have won it this year if they didn't have 2 big guns ineligible the week before regionals. Roosevelt went wire to wire in 3A by over 50 points. So I don't think that's it. Fuel at $3 a gallon, maybe, but getting from the Four Corners area to Denver is an 400mi trip through the mountains. I didn't see any less people from the outer edges of our state due to fuel prices. About the same mileage as Alliance to Omaha (with no mountains!). We do split the tournament per se, by having 2A/3A sessions separate from the 4A/5A sessions at least until the semis. We run 10 mats with plenty of room on the floor. Similar set up to yours. Ok, enough comparisons and back to the original question. Why are we increasing attendance and you are decreasing? I really don't have an answer. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the reasons given here don't wash. Prices at the arena, cost of lodging and travel, Omaha doesn't care, demographics have changed, etc. The same things occur at state meets all over the country. I have been to the state meet in Lincoln many times. I took my sons down there every year when we lived in Omaha. It had a "down home" feel to it. I haven't been to the Qwest since we moved out here before they moved state to Omaha, but I'm sure Pepsi Center has the same "corporate" almost "institutional" feel that the Qwest does. Maybe that's it. It just doesn't "feel like home". Lincoln was like a giant class reunion for everyone. Its gonna take a lot of work to get Omaha to feel the same way. It happened in Denver and it can happen in Omaha. Its just gonna take some work and cooperation on all sides. |
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